Sinem wrote:

“The excessive force of the police should be and will be investigated, but this is definitely a provocation: you can see the flags of leftist groups in pictures. Istanbul’s population is 14 million—but Turkey has 70 million. So ‘Turkish Spring’ expectations are way too unrealistic just based on the numbers. If an election were held today, Erdogan would have pulled 70 percent of the vote.

“You’re not getting a fair and valid reflection of the way things are here. The reports are simply blowing things out of proportion.

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“After police withdrew, protestors continued to destroy, using sledgehammers, shop windows, cars, police buses. Leftist groups have vandalized and spread false rumors to start provocations. It is definitely not about a park or green area. the AK party has forested an area of area 2,225 acres, and according to the new plan they will make this area greener. It was simply provocation.”

I wrote her: It seems that the urban population in Turkey is suspicious of the PM’s intent when he bans the sale of alcohol in the evening – they feel the creeping takeover of state institutions by the religion. Are they entirely wrong?

Sinem wrote back:

“Regarding the alcohol ban, the law bans the advertising of alcohol, prohibits the retail selling of alcohol in shops between 10 PM and 6 AM—except in tourist areas—and forbids its sale to anyone under 18. It means that if you are an adult, you can still buy alcohol at a bar or a restaurant after 10 PM.

“Turkey is just 10 years behind Europe on this issue. These regulations are common all over Europe, and in North America. You can buy trucks of alcohol in Turkey, and no one will stop you.

“But every year thousands of people in Turkey lose their lives in traffic accidents. 65 % of all traffic accidents happen because of drunk driving. And in Turkey, the reason for 85% of the homicides, 50% of the rapes, 50% of violent crimes, 70% of domestic violence, and 60% of cases of mental diseases are linked to alcohol use—mainly at night.”

I must note that I just spoke on the phone with our regular blogger Rachel Avraham, who writes for United With Israel, and she’s been talking to several Turks of her acquaintances who said, yes, there were Communists involved in the riots, but the majority were your middle of the road, urban Turks who’ve had it up to here with the AKP. I’m looking forward to her posting on Monday.

Until then, I’m still stunned by the similarities between the Turkish and Israeli systems—which, actually, gives me a lot of hope for the future.

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48 COMMENTS

  1. Your description of Israel government attitudes are politely put as paranoid and incorrect. I could say what I am actually thinking but you would tell me I am part of the conspiracy against you. Learn to get a broader input!

  2. Your description of Israel government attitudes are politely put as paranoid and incorrect. I could say what I am actually thinking but you would tell me I am part of the conspiracy against you. Learn to get a broader input!

  3. Booze, Brothels and Bachabazi. Turks hit the street to protest against Tayyip Erdogan’s 4 hours Booze Curfew & Public kissing Ban and No Bachabazi please. Turks carve for immorality. Bachabazi were Queer Protestors’ secret weapon used to get Islam into their wantonness predicament. Anti-islam Sentiments drew White House & Ten-Downing attention right away. Guess what US State Department ill-grammar statement was "Fundamental freedoms of expression, assembly and association, which is what it seems these individuals were doing". That’s a lot of horsemanure for one day. I agree. Tayyip Erdogan lost his mind lately when he slighted Syria and let Assad commit genocide against Syrian elders, women and children. He described Syria War as game that he loathed to share. I lost him here. Another blunder. Releasing Kurdish Terrorist Leader Abdullah Oclan to inflame Arab/Kurd sectarian wounds was Unislamic. Tayyip Erdogan apologetic attitooode blaming Turkish Police Atrocity in Taxim Square is stooopid. Who’s police boss anyway? You fool. Tayyip Erdogan blame-game ain’t over; he accused main secular opposition party for inciting crowds, whom he calls ‘a few looters’. I thought all-that-jazz was for failing to get into EU after 23 years trying. Happy Israel. It ain’t work as you sought. Try harder. Call it #OccupyGezi Bachabazi Revolution.

  4. "Turkey has a tightly centralized system of government, hostile to the free market, the enemy of small business".

    That was true under the previous regimes, who were both very pro-Israel and very statist. Erdogan has been widely praised in the West for his free market policies, with those policies given credit for Turkey's rapid economic growth during the past decade.

  5. I am disappointed by your extremely superficial analysis, as well as by your obvious paranoia. Were a vast majority as clearly Right Wing as you claim in Israel, that we wouldn't need to rely on unstable coalitions to govern the country. Indeed, were we as free to govern ourselves without the constant ingerence of the US, UN, EU, as you seem to think, that our Supreme Court and Police would have been reformed long ago, that we would have long ago annexed Judea-Samaria, reclaimed the Temple Mount, and that there would never have been a "construction freeze" in the first place. As far as Turkey is concerned, the only side I am taking is that of preferring to see Erdogan too busy at home to annoy Israel.

  6. I am disappointed by your extremely superficial analysis, as well as by your obvious paranoia. Were a vast majority as clearly Right Wing as you claim in Israel, that we wouldn't need to rely on unstable coalitions to govern the country. Indeed, were we as free to govern ourselves without the constant ingerence of the US, UN, EU, as you seem to think, that our Supreme Court and Police would have been reformed long ago, that we would have long ago annexed Judea-Samaria, reclaimed the Temple Mount, and that there would never have been a "construction freeze" in the first place. As far as Turkey is concerned, the only side I am taking is that of preferring to see Erdogan too busy at home to annoy Israel.

  7. I am disappointed by your extremely superficial analysis, as well as by your obvious paranoia. Were a vast majority as clearly Right Wing as you claim in Israel, that we wouldn't need to rely on unstable coalitions to govern the country. Indeed, were we as free to govern ourselves without the constant ingerence of the US, UN, EU, as you seem to think, that our Supreme Court and Police would have been reformed long ago, that we would have long ago annexed Judea-Samaria, reclaimed the Temple Mount, and that there would never have been a "construction freeze" in the first place. As far as Turkey is concerned, the only side I am taking is that of preferring to see Erdogan too busy at home to annoy Israel.

  8. I am disappointed by your extremely superficial analysis, as well as by your obvious paranoia. Were a vast majority as clearly Right Wing as you claim in Israel, that we wouldn't need to rely on unstable coalitions to govern the country. Indeed, were we as free to govern ourselves without the constant ingerence of the US, UN, EU, as you seem to think, that our Supreme Court and Police would have been reformed long ago, that we would have long ago annexed Judea-Samaria, reclaimed the Temple Mount, and that there would never have been a "construction freeze" in the first place. As far as Turkey is concerned, the only side I am taking is that of preferring to see Erdogan too busy at home to annoy Israel.

  9. The economkic growth is happening despite the grip of the banks and the tycoons on the country. Charlie, it's not government that has the grip, its the more permanent government, the one that never goes away. You may know them as AIG…

  10. Socialists want control of their own work places, as in the place they work, or the farms they grow crops in, Communism such as what Russia had , work places are controlled by government. What type of socialist are we talking about here? Looks like the type we might see in Europe? as in Social security heaps of social help? Should we all read Noam Chomsky to sort this out? Maybe.

  11. Unbelievable Yori Yanover. Firstly, I also have been following Sinem, Serra, Aylin and all the rest for quite some time and have been very supportive of them.

    But their attempts to spin this have backfired on facebook so now the story is being told through you-using even the same picture sinem was using.

    As someone who lived in Turkey until a week ago, I know a lot of people protesting. Some were my former students, others friends. Some secular, some religious. All angry.

    You can compare the numbers at the May day parade-which was violent and had regions of the city in a fog of tear gas and look at those crowds to the crowds now. A massive difference. Sinem posts about 2000+ acres of parks-what is she throwing in the Belgad forest into that number? That park at Taksim-the true heart of the city-is the only green space in that area and none more for miles. I am a foreigner but I was annoyed when I heard the news too.

    As for alcohol restrictions this was just part 2. Part 1 was just over a month ago banning alcohol sales within 100 metres of a school or mosque. With 3300 Mosques in Istanbul strategically placed to blast the call of prayer at 90 decibels wherever you are-it means for a vast area of the city you cannot drink-all the bars etc to go.

    Thirdly this is about now if you want a promotion at work your wife better be veiled and undue pressure put on people to conform to the AKP's version of islam. Add to this women being harassed in various areas of the city for their style of dress.

    Lastly this is about Erdogan trying to change the constitution to remove the Prime Minister office and merge it into the Presidency and then make himself President with greater powers and continuing yet another term. Alongside this is the paranoia that has half the army brass in jail as well as scores of journalists.

    Turkey is going from a tolerant moderate secular society to becoming an Authoritarian regime under the neo-Sultan Erdogan. And he is backed by the rural population whereas Istanbul has all the wealth of the country, all the diversity, all the liberal values but make up about 1/5th. So it is mob rule, and dictatorship of the majority, not a democracy now at all.

    Again your article is an insult to the hard working ordinary Turkish people who were quite happy as things were and not a slide towards islamism.

  12. In America, such anti-alcohol restraints seem excessive. I live in North Carolina, which does not sell wine before noon on Sundays; otherwise, when the stores are open, it's for sale. We have, instead, DUI laws – can't drink with "too much" alcohol, probably a ridiculously low level. Common practice nowadays is to have a "designated driver" who does not touch alcohol, and who drives the car.

  13. James Campbell Fern · You're very nostalgic about Turkey's secular past, but it involved a few military coups, a few periods of disappearances and imprisonment of enemies of the state, and the persecution of religious leaders. Indeed, Turkey only began to thrive under Muslim-leaning governments to the point where it now has the fastest growing economy in Europe.

    The ban on alcohol is familiar to anyone living in NY City. I sat in countless meetings of my local board over licensing new bars — and the restrictions include distance from schools and churches. In NY you can get arrested for drinking beer in the open. And the U.S. has hundreds of dry counties where alcohol is not sold.

    Sure, a political party that's amassed so much power will start flexing its muscles. They want a more religious society, including all the exterior manifestations. But you know they can only go so far, because they don't own the military. In the end, they're working with a pretty big sword hanging overhead.

    As to the regular, hard working, secular Turks — I understand their dilemma, it's much like secular Israelis who dislike the increased presence of religion in Israel's public life. It's tough. The answer to that is in more dialogue, not in provocation, certainly not in destruction.

  14. This is absolutely over the top and an an insult to our intelligence. It's counter intuitive and defies the reality that glaringly stares us in the face. One has to wonder why Erdogan's agenda is being pushed and sanitized here while comparing Israel and Turkey. Turkish citizens are rightfully crying out in opposition to a dictatorship, and Yori resorts to the same tactics often used by the left to marginalize and stifle the voices of dissent. The primarily uninformed public needs to know the truth, not this whitewashed version.

  15. 2009 Erdogan:
    "wherever Jews settle, they make money. They are not property owners, as being tenants suits them best. On the other hand, whatever we have or do not have, we will invest in our houses."

  16. Recep Tayyip Erdogan.
    Siirt in December 1997.
    "The mosques are our barracks,
    the domes are our helmets,
    the minarets are our swords,
    and the faithful are our army."

  17. When Mr. Erdogan began his political career, he did not hide his agenda. In September 1994, while mayor of Istanbul, he promised, "We will turn all our schools into Imam Hatips." Two months later he said, "Thank God Almighty, I am a servant of the Shariah." In May 1996, he called for a ban on alcohol. In the months before his dismissal from the mayoralty, his cynicism was clear. "Democracy is like a streetcar," he quipped. "You ride it until you arrive at your destination and then you step off."

    by Michael Rubin.
    Wall Street Journal.
    October 19, 2006.

  18. Yori, you are edging into conspiracy theory territory. In the US, the banks were devastated by the 2008 crash; stockholders lost most of their investments. That is true of AIG as well; it is now worth about 2% of what it once was worth.

  19. Yori can publish the VERY SAME propagandist rag under a variety of supposed authors, it's still the same BS. The jihadists that comprise the ottoman regime are slowly but surely incorporating a fascist islamist government – and the people have woken up! I do find it interesting though how when your "friend" sinem piosts articles you usually preface them by threatening to censor all who disagree.

    But I await: I would like to hear your reaction to Erdogan now calling for all the protesters to be hanged. It is the way of the ottomans to massacre their opponents. Just ask the Kurds, Armenians, and if Erdogan has his way – the Jews.

  20. You're a piece of garbage. There is no such thing as an Islamic sect that is Israeli friendly, let alone sects of any kind. There is only Islam, so read the Quran and the hadiths before you talk, you donkey.

  21. There is no right/left jew. They are all communists who embrace the destruction of all Christians. Its in their holy books. Jews historically have been 3rd party agitants between 2 groups/people. That's why they are lawyers; to stir up hostilities. Its disingenuous double minded nonsense.

  22. Islam IS doing the jews dirty work. Islam was written by jewish scribes. Islam is jewish and is fighting the jews enemies, the white Christians. See: Sabbatai Zevi the jewish messiah who converted to Islam. Jews screamed loudest for liberal Muslim immigration into Europe ask that idiot Barbara Spector.

  23. Yavi Ore · This is a civilized website. If you cannot speak like an adult with respect to other, I strongly advise you to go elsewhere. You will not receive another warning — one more rude outburst and you'll be banned.

  24. Johnny Simson · You'll have to solve a mystery, then. If Erdogan is the repressive Islamist that he is, how come Turkey is so prosperous? It has the highest annual GDP growth in all of Europe, the lowest unemployment, a thriving tourism industry. These are not normally associated with a Sharia state that isn't an oil producer. How come business is flocking to such a repressive, Islamist, hellish country?

  25. Яков, я был прав про Синема. I told you she was a DISINFORMATION SHILL for the ERDOGAN puppets. Odnar has channel 9 operating because Erdogan wants it that way, and he uses him to dupe the Jewish public and Israel into thinking Turkey is an "ally". divine justice, shills exposed.

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